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Old 05-11-13   #1
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Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers





A few small brick-and-mortar retailers have banded together under the platform of We will act (WWA) to seek protection from online retailers, who they say are undercutting them with predatory pricing. The retailers, mostly from Bangalore have written to the Competition Commission of India, complaining that their online retailers are selling goods below cost and skirting Indian laws on foreign direct investment in retail.

Hari Rastogi, a Bangalore-based retailer of electronic goods and founder of WWA questioned the legality of operations by foreign-funded online retailers in his letter to CCI. "When venture capital funding is not allowed in e-commerce, these companies are registering offices in Singapore and routing the money in for the same business," he wrote on October 20. India allows 51% FDI in multi-brand retail, but does not allow overseas investors to directly participate in online retail.

Citing a unnamed "10 year old computer distributor in Bangalore" The WWA site says that.
“The XKart (flipkart) guys purchased the hard disk from me at Rs.5200.00 and they were selling in their website for Rs.4400.00. This kind of unethical business practices are spoiling our market. I am not supplying to any online retailers any more but they have money and buying from any distributors across India or importing directly. If they will continue this kind of loss making business practices I have no option but to close my distribution business."
On its website About WWA says that :
Currently we are working on the issue of the UNETHICAL BUSINESS PRACTICES OF ONLINE RETAILERS IN INDIA to safeguard the interests of 50 lakhs plus physical retailers.

Some online retailers in India are like BIGDE BETE (spoiled brat) of their BIG PAPA of USA. They are getting so much money for doing so much of experiment in India and kind of playing GAMBLING. Every six months they are changing their business models, spending heavily on advertisements, selling everything to everyone at much below their cost prices, running business in huge operating losses and that is adversely affecting the traditional physical retailers.

There can be possibility if some enemies of our country or terror outfits giving funding to these MONKEYS to do so much drama and make lakhs of retailers loose their piece of mind and livelihood.


India is an open democratic country. All kind of business at all level must run with ethics and fair business practices and what some online retailers are doing is completely nonsense.

WE WILL ACT together to fix this very serious issue together with the help of all who believe that there must be survival and growth opportunity for all. SURVEY BHAWANTU SUKHINAH..

We will also be working on some other social issues after a period of time in near future. (none can be thought of as of now)

Note : Remarks in red are of my own.

-------------------

WWA is also approaching the govt, political parties, manufacturers, and investors funding online retailing companies to assist in their mission.

In an "Appeal to Unethical online retailers:" WWA says that. "Stop your dirty business policies. You can never kill Indian market using money. In very short time you will be caught red handed by long arm of law and will be punished. You will be soon punished for making mockery of system and unethical price war. Make your choice to run away or get punished by your company, investors, political parties and law of land. Foreign funded Unethical online retailers leave India!"

The WWA also suggests some ways to harass the online retailers.
Let’s take some small stepsWe will not purchase or supply anything to these unethical online retailers. ( XKart, Ydeal, KBong..)

​Lets boycott them.

Let’s now punish them:
1- Let's place Cash on delivery orders for Rs.40000.00 rupees items every alternate day and cancel when delivery boy comes to delivery. This will make them to lose their fat by Rs.1000.00 at least.

2- Whenever you are free call to their customer care and waste their time. This will increase their customer care expenses.

------------------------------------------

WWA may have a point about FDI coming into retail illegally. Flipkart is also under investigation for this because of which they have changed their business model. However I do not think it will be easy for them to prove predatory pricing at the CCI.

As and article in the Hindu explains The Hindu Business Line : Predatory pricing: Lessons for India Inc
Originally Posted by The Hindu
The Competition Law provides that any conduct in a market by an undertaking, which amounts to the abuse of its dominant position, and which may affect trade in India is prohibited by the said Act and may be subjected to consequential penalties as prescribed by the Act.

Thus, there is a two-stage test:
(1) whether an undertaking is dominant in a relevant market; and,
(2) if so, whether it is abusing that dominant position. The prohibition is only on the abuse of the dominant position, not the position itself.

This is the crucial difference between the Competition Law and the obsolete MRTP, where dominance by itself, would suffice. The Competition Commission set up under the Competition Act would find an undertaking's behaviour an abuse after a detailed examination of the market concerned and the effects of the undertaking's conduct.
Now according to the WWA's own site http://wewillact.com/appeal.html "In India the e-tailing is only 0.01% and most of that is travel" So if online retailers are not in a dominant position, they cannot be persecuted for abusing their dominant position.

In any case, lets see how it goes. You can catch updates from Hari Rastogi over here https://www.facebook.com/hari.rastogi.3
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Old 05-11-13   #2
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Originally Posted by vijayninel View Post
Let’s now punish them:
1- Let's place Cash on delivery orders for Rs.40000.00 rupees items every alternate day and cancel when delivery boy comes to delivery. This will make them to lose their fat by Rs.1000.00 at least.

2- Whenever you are free call to their customer care and waste their time. This will increase their customer care expenses.

I totally detest this and in fact instead of inviting any good will, they will end up losing my respect and empathy.
I prefer Cash on delivery over any other means of payment and it would be unfortunate to see unscrupulous people like these exploiting this awesome service and deliberately causing harm to legitimate online retailers as well as their genuine customers.

Online retailers price their products competitively as they save up on building, infrastructure and surplus workforce.
Besides, the cost factor and ease of online retail beats arguing with a shack owner who lacks both courtesy and knowledge.
Sites like Flipkart and snapdeal have an awesome refund policy as well.

Brick and mortar shops and small retailers are dinosaurs in this age and typical of disguised unemployment.
In contrast they don't even provide basic services and most customers have to claim warranty on their own accord anyway.

Its a good thing online retailers don't have much of a physical presence so that goons and unions could flex their muscles and throw stones at them.
Hence its down to the old bashing and conspiracy theories. Why should a customer pay the exorbitant rental price for a shop located in a posh colony?

I think its about time these brick and mortar retailers learned that if you can't beat em, join em like most distributors and retailers have done.
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Old 05-11-13   #3
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

And the person behind this (Hari Rastogi, harirastogi@gmail.com) himself is running a flop online shop. It is his frustration for not been able to compete with better players.
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Old 05-11-13   #4
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Pathetic. They are thinking people will join them on this, but that will never happen. Jokes on them. There are many retailers who have such asshole ego , that was my main when I switched to online sites to get my goods. No hassle of hearing the bullshit city retailers gives us. And to add on that, online retailers gives low price and refund policies, it;s a win to them and to the customers as well.

I respect flipkart and other sites who are doing this to local shopwalle's , let them learn the lesson to respect customers which they only do when you go and buy something from them and the minute you have paid the cash, they treat you like shit (the local shopwalle's I mean here)
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Originally Posted by Sobirvs View Post
I respect flipkart and other sites who are doing this to local shopwalle's , let them learn the lesson to respect customers which they only do when you go and buy something from them and the minute you have paid the cash, they treat you like shit (the local shopwalle's I mean here)
exactly
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Old 05-11-13   #6
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

I am appalled by these stupid people !!
I am aghast and want them to be taken care of by online members of all platforms !!

It is people like these who are making the entry of Walmart etc, which will be beneficial for Indian consumers to come and set up shop in India !!
Bastids !!!



A standing round of Applause for @vijayninel, for bringing this into our discussions.. !!
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Old 05-11-13   #7
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Why would "WE" care about? Why would we sue someone who gives us genuine products at a competitive price?
I can understand their situation, but this is just pathetic.

Be competitive for Christ's sake. As long as online retailers give these deals, they would get the cake.
As my Mr. Spock said, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few".
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Old 05-11-13   #8
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

If these people are so afraid of market economics, they should see how Giants fall in a free economy.

That said, if they want to save use from illegal funding, go and stop property builders from charging me exorbitant flats with a Baniya like attitude.
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Old 05-11-13   #9
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Here is the letter he has written to CCI btw. You can read more of his thoughts on this here Competition commission of India must take some action against the UNETHICAL business practices of some e-commerce players - The Rodinhoods

Also on TOI today Price war: Retailers write to CCI; accuses e-tailers Flipkart, Snapdeal of predatory pricing - The Times of India



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Old 05-11-13   #10
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Originally Posted by vijayninel View Post
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Let’s now punish them:
1- Let's place Cash on delivery orders for Rs.40000.00 rupees items every alternate day and cancel when delivery boy comes to delivery. This will make them to lose their fat by Rs.1000.00 at least.

2- Whenever you are free call to their customer care and waste their time. This will increase their customer care expenses.
I'd instead file a complaint against them for suggesting these unethical ideas. The problem is they can't do business, and became too suborn and this was bound to happen.

Everything is going online, and I don't think this can be stopped.

And they are claiming online retailers unethical and they themselves are suggesting unethical means.

And regarding pricing, I'm not a businessman, but AFAIK, one can sell at any price below MRP if he wishes too. Isn't it? If I wish I can give it for free too. Is there any problem legally on this?
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Old 05-11-13   #11
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Originally Posted by krishnandu View Post
And regarding pricing, I'm not a businessman, but AFAIK, one can sell at any price below MRP if he wishes too. Isn't it? If I wish I can give it for free too. Is there any problem legally on this?
Yes. Predatory pricing is illegal in many countries around the world including in India. However proving it is very difficult and not a simple matter. To prove predatory pricing you have to show that a dominant market player is deliberately pricing the the goods/services below cost in order to drive out other players.

I think Rastogi has a case that the online sellers selling below cost, however I am not convinced that he will be able to prove so easily that they are a dominant player.

As some of you might know, In the past I have myself expressed doubts on the business model that some of the e-commerce sites are following Are Letsbuy and Flipkart Just Bubbles Waiting to Burst?

I am still not fully convinced that Flipkart and many other sites are out of the red yet. However they have expanded their business by leaps and bounds and may eventually succeed.

Regarding the allegations that Flipkart and some others got foreign FDI illegally, I think that allegation is correct at least in spirit if not legally. The Enforcement Directorate has been probing that for a year now. We are yet to hear about the matter from them.
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Old 05-11-13   #12
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Originally Posted by krishnandu View Post
And regarding pricing, I'm not a businessman, but AFAIK, one can sell at any price below MRP if he wishes too. Isn't it? If I wish I can give it for free too. Is there any problem legally on this?
One can sell below MRP but not at any prices. I mean if someone do sell at any price, it's I guess not illegal, but my dad is in electronics business and he can't sell for example samsung LEDTV for any less than the one quoted by distributor (DP minus 5% profit) , if someone do sell it for less amount and if other shopwalle get's to know about this, they will complain this to the samsung head of that particular area and then that shopwalla will not be authorized seller anymore for samsung. I have heard this from my Dad so just sharing here, though I don't know how tightly that rule is followed but that rule is there. That rule has been given a term which I don't remember now.
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

^^^ I remember a friend told me about this when a customer claimed that any dealer have quoted/sold him XYZ mobile for less than dealer price
He was happy that now the company will take action against that dealer as they cant sell (proper invoice not a 'kaccha bill') below DP
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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

Really bad to know. On one hand the fact s etailers r routing monies from tax havens to mask the funding and taxation issue. On the other hand it has also affected the economy at large. I'm sure if any of u have ever gone through economics lectures u will agree for this. First, targeting the etailers as terrorist funding is a pathetic move.. Second, to an extent these guys r right also. The economy is not going through right phase and employment is going down as days r passing by. Think from a perspective about how v have started buying online looking for discounts, our once good frns who used to give good discounts at their shops r now forgotten. The problem with etailers is that they r not making monies and not letting anyone make monies. Specially during the festive period.

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Re: Terrorists, Enemies Are Funding Flipkart, Snapdeal Etc - Bangalore Retailers

I can't believe I read this BS.

Instead of competing, these guys are whining since their profit margins are being reduced by a growing and more consumer friendly competitor who actually gives two hoots about their customers. Even if Flipkart charges a bit more, I will still get half my stuff from them for one reason- their 30 day hassle free return policy. Try going to a brick and mortar shop and return something for a new one and you will go through absolute hell. Not on Flipkart... I hope these ******** shut down instead of adapting to a changing environment. Its called survival of the fittest.

If these guys are hell bent on charging on the MRP of goods, then best of luck in trying to make yourself stand out from the crowd. Even they charge below the MRP for most if not all goods and still maintain a 50-70% profit margin... Its stories like these which make me feel good about getting my stuff from Flipkart. Not only do they have a greater variety of stuff which cannot be ideally stored in physical stores due to storage constrains, they still charge lesser as well.

''1- Let's place Cash on delivery orders for Rs.40000.00 rupees items every alternate day and cancel when delivery boy comes to delivery. This will make them to lose their fat by Rs.1000.00 at least.
2- Whenever you are free call to their customer care and waste their time. This will increase their customer care expenses.''

I hope Flipkart impents a 3 strike system where more than 3 failed CoD orders result in a blacklist of that IP and address. Their customer care is one of the best I've seen and these guys are just trolling now. Wheres that blasphemy law when we need it?

Last edited by JsDart; 05-11-13 at 11:16 PM.
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