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Tbone1989 22-04-14 12:46 AM

Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
I need opinion about buying a hard disk for booting in my system.

I am confused in buying one for my PC now coz the previous one is not in a good condition. My two options are 1) SSD or 2) a normal hard disk( WD Caviar Green or Seagate Barracuda)

I am using a Gigabyte G41M Combo Motherboard and Core 2 Quad Q8600 and 4GB DDR3. can I install an SSD as a bootdrive? if so I am looking for an 128 GB SSD.
Mainly I have to use the system for music production.
My shortlisted options are.

1. SanDisk SSD 128 GB Laptop Internal Hard Drive (SDSSDP-128G-G25) - SanDisk: Flipkart.com

2.ADATA Premier Pro 128 GB SSD Internal Hard Drive (Premier Pro SP900/128GB) - ADATA: Flipkart.com

3. Plextor M5S 128 GB Desktop & Laptop Internal Hard Drive (M5S 128GB) - Plextor: Flipkart.com


WD Caviar Green or Seagate Barracuda??

When I have been going through some reviews its been told that Caviar Green series can't be used for a boot disk. But the expert reviews of WD Caviar green and Seagate Barracuda showing the read and write rate is more for WD Caviar Green. then whats the problem for using WD Caviar as a boot disk eventhough its a 5400 RPM hard disk?

Expert reviews :

WD : Western Digital Caviar Green 2TB review | Expert Reviews

Seagate : Seagate Barracuda 2TB review | Expert Reviews


So boot drive as 1) Seagate or WD? ( Amoung these two which is better)
2) SSD ? (Is it applicable to install in my PC, if so which model?)


:plzhelp:

invader 22-04-14 01:55 AM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
You verywell can install a ssd... I'll suggest go for the sp900 .. It has good review and seems good for the money spent


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

realandR3cys 22-04-14 09:37 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Yes. You definately can go in for a SSD. It's a long term solution, and you can reap benefits of it for many years. SSD nowadays have great endurance ratings.

But the thing is, that SSD wouldn't be used to it's full benefits cause of your system. You mobo just has SATA II ports (3Gb/s), so your theoritical SATA3 SSD speeds would be limited to 270-280MB/s, compared to 540-550MB/s on native SATA3.
So, there's a little bummer.
But if you plan to upgrade your system shortly, no worries there. Also i think you can bear that for the time being.

For the SSD, Adata PP is indeed great like Invader said. But i'd personally suggest to go for the Samsung 840 EVO instead. It's by far the best VFM SSD in the market right now with performance close to the PRO variant, yet costing 2K less.
Also Samsung has an upper hand in the it's Magician software, and also aftersales. Comes for 6.4K for the 120GB variant.

And to answer your question why WD Greens shouldn't be used as boot drives -

1. They are very unstable, i.e. they fail a lot. They were never designed to run as boot drives, but as storage drives (still wouldn't recommend it for huge data storage).
They form the most low end spectrum of the Caviar legacy, so ultimately it shows. Greens consume very low power for that.

2. Their Intellipark/Intelliseek feature - A Green drive is rated to operate between 5400 & 7200 RPM.
What this Intelliseek does is, if your drive is kept at standby for some time, it spins down the RPM from it's max state 7200 to min 5400.
The disadvantage is - let's say you're using this as your boot drive. You kept it at a standby, and after sometime you want to fire up some intensive APP/Game - firstly it would take ages to launch, and while loading intensive files/maps in-app/game, it would just be too slow.
It can't provide that efficiency that a native 7200 rated Barracuda drive can give.

And that's pretty much it.

Hitesh12 23-04-14 05:41 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by realandR3cys (Post 926780)
But the thing is, that SSD wouldn't be used to it's full benefits cause of your system. You mobo just has SATA II ports (3Gb/s), so your theoritical SATA3 SSD speeds would be limited to 270-280MB/s, compared to 540-550MB/s on native SATA3.

Read this
Basically negligible diff between those SATAs

@OP - Go for a Samsung or Corsair SSD

realandR3cys 23-04-14 08:37 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitesh12 (Post 926918)
Read this
Basically negligible diff between those SATAs

Actually, the difference is quite noticeable.
See, when we compare SATA2 and SATA3, we basically compare the data transfer speeds, either in Read/Write or in 4K Random (mostly these two). And that is the thing i've mentioned earlier.

If you look at the Read/Write transfer speeds, it can easily seen that SATA2 is just bottlenecking the true potential of a SATA3 drive, like 840 PRO.
Again, if you look at 4K Random Read/Write which is THE most crutial for everyday workloads and data transfers, you can see SATA2 is easily blocking the PRO to perform fully.

So, TL;DR
SATA2 will obviously limit Read (and Write) speeds of a SATA3 SSD to almost 1/2 over a native SATA3 connectivity. And this is where the difference lies.

Comparing booting up speeds, or launching program times isn't the thing to compare between SATA2 & SATA3.

Hitesh12 23-04-14 08:53 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by realandR3cys (Post 926961)
Actually, the difference is quite noticeable.

The difference is only noticeable in benchmarks only. While using the same SSD in SATA2 and SATA3, one would hardly feel the difference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by realandR3cys (Post 926961)
SATA2 will obviously limit Read (and Write) speeds of a SATA3 SSD to almost 1/2 over a native SATA3 connectivity. And this is where the difference lies.

Again, in theory/benchmarks

Quote:

Originally Posted by realandR3cys (Post 926961)
Comparing booting up speeds, or launching program times isn't the thing to compare between SATA2 & SATA3.

You meant to say "SSD's performance between SATA2 and SATA3" ? IMO that's really a valid test. I mean for what else do you get an SSD ?

realandR3cys 23-04-14 09:48 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitesh12 (Post 926963)
The difference is only noticeable in benchmarks only. While using the same SSD in SATA2 and SATA3, one would hardly feel the difference.

Which difference are you talking about? Is it the system responsiveness or data transfer?

If it's system responsiveness, then it's obviously, no.
If you're saying the same for Read/Write, then it's wrong.

Read/Write Transfer rates or 4K Random would reflect the same in real world. Read/Write dosen't depend upon synthetic benchmarks. It depends on the connectivity.

People use CrystalDisk to measure the transfer rates of their drives - to see whether the Read/Write are up to the mark - there's a reason for that.
Just try to transfer 1GB (in real life) of data, either R or W, between SATA2 & SATA3. You'll see why you need SATA3 for your SSD, as SATA2 will just transfer the data at 1/2 speed/rate of what SATA3 would do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitesh12 (Post 926963)
You meant to say "SSD's performance between SATA2 and SATA3" ? IMO that's really a valid test. I mean for what else do you get an SSD ?

You get SSD for all those "real life" tests that TH has done, i.e. Boot-up times, app launch times, etc.

But you DON'T compare SATA2 & SATA3 connectivities like that. Will you ever compare USB 2 and 3 anything other than transfer speeds? No.
Same here.
When you compare SATA 2 & 3, you compare their ability to Read/Write.

So, yeah.

Tbone1989 24-04-14 02:03 AM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Thank u guys for the help.

Sent from my Lenovo P770 using Tapatalk

Tbone1989 25-04-14 07:58 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
I have been hearing from many forums that SSDs are very short life spaned. Its quite shocking though. Eventhough they are saying it doesn't have any moving parts inside it as per the manufacturers many reviewers ripped everything off.

---------- Post added at 07:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:19 PM ----------

SSDs no more reliable than hard drives | ZDNet

https://forums.geforce.com/default/t...long-its-life/

Do SSDs last longer than regular hard drives? | ITworld

---------- Post added at 07:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:30 PM ----------

If I buy a Samsung EVO 840 120 GB, my use is mostly for music production purposes, surfing, movie watching. My use of pc is mostly high. These SSDs are having life cycles. Ok, normal HDD will last within 5 years, but this much amount spend for a very low capacity model( normal consumer thinking). I am confused. The life cycles won't last more than 3 years(SSD)from some sites. and some sites saying if the drive is dead there are less chances of data retrieving.

realandR3cys 26-04-14 11:35 AM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Ignore those sites then.
SSDs have come a long way since then.
Maybe 4-5 yrs ago, SSD endurance could have been a issue, but SSDs have evolved a lot now.

A typical Samsung 840 EVO has a MTBF of 1.5M hours. That actually translates to 171 yrs.
But that isn't really the real life span, is it?
It's just the theoritical life span.
So, what's the real life span of that EVO (if you ask me)?

Let me tell you that the original 840, even under critical and agressive stress reports, it can endure and last upto 11 yrs. Yes, Eleven.

Now the 840 EVO same TLC NAND as that of the original 840, but it's produced at a smaller geometry process, of 19nm. That means more efficiency and it would last more long than the original 840's 11 yrs.
So, it's very very much reliable than you could think of.

And BTW the links you have posted are like 3-4 yrs old.
And one out of them is like from '08. Things have changed a lot & lot since then man.

Tbone1989 26-04-14 01:28 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
ohooo......ok. so those reports are outdated and SSD s evolved better? mmm.

---------- Post added at 01:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:18 PM ----------

Bro, there is a doubt.

AnandTech | Samsung SSD 840 EVO Review: 120GB, 250GB, 500GB, 750GB & 1TB Models Tested

in this thread they have shown something about NAND Writes per Day(this is an updated report comparing to others I have posed before). Average life span is shown that 7.something years. if 100 Gb per day(intensive as they say) 3.something years. My doubt is what is this this much gb per day or nand writes per day. I have read that there are finite no of cycles for SSD. My usage is like using Cubase, Protools, Nuendo, FL for music production. In these DAWs(digital audio workstations) it uses VSTs for music production. a vst size may range from mb - 40 or 80 GB. I use the system for mainly music studies plus normal use too. these vsts comes with a dll file(VST,VSTi) plus a library folder. My plan is to set this SSD as a boot drive. so there by including all the DAWs in that drive and some vst's dll files and library only and some dll only in ssd and library in another hdd(internal). so what should be the average nand writes per day?

realandR3cys 26-04-14 05:46 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
NAND Writes for a consumer, like us, it's okay to accept 30 GB/day.
But since you'd be running a dedicated workstation, 40GB/day, and that's the most aggresive you can get. I've seen most people running DAW, averaging samples at 30-40gigs.

So, even if you make 40GB/day NAND writes :
That makes,

120/40 = (3*1129)/365 = 9 yrs of endurance

1129 is the standard Program Erase cycle for a TLC based NAND.

Tbone1989 06-05-14 11:32 PM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Thanks for all for the replies guy. Really thankful.

---------- Post added at 11:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 PM ----------

:) :ahoi:

trew 17-10-14 07:12 AM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by realandR3cys (Post 926780)
Yes. You definately can go in for a SSD. It's a long term solution, and you can reap benefits of it for many years. SSD nowadays have great endurance ratings.

But the thing is, that SSD wouldn't be used to it's full benefits cause of your system. You mobo just has SATA II ports (3Gb/s), so your theoritical SATA3 SSD speeds would be limited to 270-280MB/s, compared to 540-550MB/s on native SATA3.
So, there's a little bummer.
But if you plan to upgrade your system shortly, no worries there. Also i think you can bear that for the time being.

For the SSD, Adata PP is indeed great like Invader said. But i'd personally suggest to go for the Samsung 840 EVO instead. It's by far the best VFM SSD in the market right now with performance close to the PRO variant, yet costing 2K less.
Also Samsung has an upper hand in the it's Magician software, and also aftersales. Comes for 6.4K for the 120GB variant.

And to answer your question why WD Greens shouldn't be used as boot drives -

1. They are very unstable, i.e. they fail a lot. They were never designed to run as boot drives, but as storage drives (still wouldn't recommend it for huge data storage).
They form the most low end spectrum of the Caviar legacy, so ultimately it shows. Greens consume very low power for that.

2. Their Intellipark/Intelliseek feature - A Green drive is rated to operate between 5400 & 7200 RPM.
What this Intelliseek does is, if your drive is kept at standby for some time, it spins down the RPM from it's max state 7200 to min 5400.
The disadvantage is - let's say you're using this as your boot drive. You kept it at a standby, and after sometime you want to fire up some intensive APP/Game - firstly it would take ages to launch, and while loading intensive files/maps in-app/game, it would just be too slow.
It can't provide that efficiency that a native 7200 rated Barracuda drive can give.

And that's pretty much it.

Dear realandR3cys,
I want to add a samsung 840evo to my system which has a MOBO of Asus M5A97 LE R2.0. Will i be fully able utilize the SSD ? Kindly suggest.
Previously i have a WD Green which started showing problems after 4 months of buying. So i want to replace it with a SSD.

BULLZI 17-10-14 10:59 AM

Re: Good Opinion in Buying Boot Disk
 
Your kono has sata 3,port? Samsung evo is a gr8 ssd. U can surely use it. I am using the pro version. Itbis superb. But get at least 120 GB.


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